UnSeen

Just to clarify, no I wasn't offered co-owner/owner - I just didn't care for the title since at the time of asking being 'HA' was the same thing. It'd literally be a title difference, not a job difference.
Further to that, at the time that I think you are talking about, it literally wouldn't have mattered if me and Conor swapped owner/HA - since he was doing tech and decisions, I was doing people/events and decisions, we were working well together and so the title roles made little difference to me.
However since being owner does mean you get the final say and later down the line there were a few decisions that I think I'd have objected to if they were brought to me (I had been inactive for a brief stint due to irl stuff, and Gunstar had also been inactive for an extensive time at this point) then perhaps a change of leadership would have had an impact - but that's all 'what ifs', and it's pointless to grumble about it at this point. 
I'd say it's ironic that the big word at the top of the page is so often overlooked. OB is a community - and by that I mean people shouldn't be judging it based off business models for growth and people shouldn't be exclusive/semi-libertarian in behaviour when approaching a community's leadership structure, it should be supportive and inviting (on both sides).
Then again this is OB, and half of us can't read ?

Just to clarify, no I wasn't offered co-owner/owner - I just didn't care for the title since at the time of asking being 'HA' was the same thing. It'd literally be a title difference, not a job difference.
Further to that, at the time that I think you are talking about, it literally wouldn't have mattered if me and Conor swapped owner/HA - since he was doing tech and decisions, I was doing people/events and decisions, we were working well together and so the title roles made little difference to me.
However since being owner does mean you get the final say and later down the line there were a few decisions that I think I'd have objected to if they were brought to me (I had been inactive for a brief stint due to irl stuff, and Gunstar had also been inactive for an extensive time at this point) then perhaps a change of leadership would have had an impact - but that's all 'what ifs', and it's pointless to grumble about it at this point. 
I'd say it's ironic that the big word at the top of the page is so often overlooked. OB is a community - and by that I mean people shouldn't be judging it based off business models for growth and people shouldn't be exclusive/semi-libertarian in behaviour when approaching a community's leadership structure, it should be supportive and inviting (on both sides).
Then again this is OB, and half of us can't read ?

Just to clarify, no I wasn't offered co-owner/owner - I just didn't care for the title since at the time of asking being 'HA' was the same thing. It'd literally be a title difference, not a job difference.
Further to that, at the time that I think you are talking about, it literally wouldn't have mattered if me and Conor swapped owner/HA - since he was doing tech and decisions, I was doing people/events and decisions, we were working well together and so the title roles made little difference to me.
However since being owner does mean you get the final say and later down the line there were a few decisions that I think I'd have objected to if they were brought to me (I had been inactive for a brief stint due to irl stuff, and Gunstar had also been inactive for an extensive time at this point) then perhaps a change of leadership would have had an impact - but that's all 'what ifs', and it's pointless to grumble about it at this point. 
I'd say it's ironic that the big word at the top of the page is so often overlooked. OB is a community - and by that I mean people shouldn't be judging it based off business models for growth and people shouldn't be exclusive/semi-libertarian in behaviour when approaching a community's leadership structure, it should be supportive and inviting (on both sides).
Then again this is OB, and half of us can't read ?

Just to clarify, no I wasn't offered co-owner/owner - I just didn't care for the title since at the time of asking being 'HA' was the same thing. It'd literally be a title difference, not a job difference.
Further to that, at the time that I think you are talking about, it literally wouldn't have mattered if me and Conor swapped owner/HA - since he was doing tech and decisions, I was doing people/events and decisions, we were working well together and so the title roles made little difference to me.
However since being owner does mean you get the final say and later down the line there were a few decisions that I think I'd have objected to if they were brought to me (I had been inactive for a brief stint due to irl stuff, and Gunstar had also been inactive for an extensive time at this point) then perhaps a change of leadership would have had an impact - but that's all 'what ifs', and it's pointless to grumble about it at this point. 
I'd say it's ironic that the big word at the top of the page is so often overlooked. OB is a community - and by that I mean people shouldn't be judging it based off business models for growth and people shouldn't be exclusive/semi-libertarian in behaviour when approaching a community's leadership structure, it should be supportive and inviting (on both sides).
Then again this is OB, and half of us can't read ?

Just to clarify, no I wasn't offered co-owner/owner - I just didn't care for the title since at the time of asking being 'HA' was the same thing. It'd literally be a title difference, not a job difference.
Further to that, at the time that I think you are talking about, it literally wouldn't have mattered if me and Conor swapped owner/HA - since he was doing tech and decisions, I was doing people/events and decisions, we were working well together and so the title roles made little difference to me.
However since being owner does mean you get the final say and later down the line there were a few decisions that I think I'd have objected to if they were brought to me (I had been inactive for a brief stint due to irl stuff, and Gunstar had also been inactive for an extensive time at this point) then perhaps a change of leadership would have had an impact - but that's all 'what ifs', and it's pointless to grumble about it at this point. 
I'd say it's ironic that the big word at the top of the page is so often overlooked. OB is a community - and by that I mean people shouldn't be judging it based off business models for growth and people shouldn't be exclusive/semi-libertarian in behaviour when approaching a community's leadership structure, it should be supportive and inviting (on both sides).
Then again this is OB, and half of us can't read ?

Just to clarify, no I wasn't offered co-owner/owner - I just didn't care for the title since at the time of asking being 'HA' was the same thing. It'd literally be a title difference, not a job difference.
Further to that, at the time that I think you are talking about, it literally wouldn't have mattered if me and Conor swapped owner/HA - since he was doing tech and decisions, I was doing people/events and decisions, we were working well together and so the title roles made little difference to me.
However since being owner does mean you get the final say and later down the line there were a few decisions that I think I'd have objected to if they were brought to me (I had been inactive for a brief stint due to irl stuff, and Gunstar had also been inactive for an extensive time at this point) then perhaps a change of leadership would have had an impact - but that's all 'what ifs', and it's pointless to grumble about it at this point. 
I'd say it's ironic that the big word at the top of the page is so often overlooked. OB is a community - and by that I mean people shouldn't be judging it based off business models for growth and people shouldn't be exclusive/semi-libertarian in behaviour when approaching a community's leadership structure, it should be supportive and inviting (on both sides).
Then again this is OB, and half of us can't read ?

I mean, I'm just gonna say it. This situation is blindly obvious, and I'm shocked that it gets discussed so frequently considering we actually have quite a lot of smart people in this community. Hopefully this will clear up the situation from how I see it. And TBH, this is mostly aimed towards the hardcore OG guys.
Many members and regulars (no, not solely the usual suspects) love to complain about one or several of the following things:
1) OB isn't growing.
2) OB isn't finding the right game so won't progress.
3) If OB is attempting to progress in a certain area/way - they will complain that it's wrong way of doing it.
4) The leadership is inadequate.
5) OB SHOULD NOT progress, because it's perfect the way it is with the old school member base and a teamspeak (???)
 
Many love to complain, but do nothing about it. And no, writing a 1,000 word post on the forums on this topic does not mean you are attempting to do something good for OB. As far as I can see (no offence to past and current mods) there are only about 5 people who have put a good amount of work into this community in the last 2-3 years - Wist, Unseen and Sir_Conor being 3 of those. I am not attempting to take the moral high ground, I've been guilty of this in the past - right now I don't really put any effort in, but I don't complain either. Watching from afar I've come to see it's such a dickish thing to do, these people (for free - and even out of their own pockets) put in mad hours into trying to spearhead new servers, set up new landing pages, transition to a free discord which represents teamspeak as closely as possible for you guys, and all you do is haul hate, lol.
 
The split in this community seems to me to be:
1) Those who will only ever go into the OG channel and no where else, and will - quite literally - refuse to play with other people in this community because they don't feel comfortable doing so - at an extreme end, some of you even have about 15+ members in this community blocked/muted. The former is a fairly low number, because there are a few guys who spend a lot of time in the OG channel but are regularly open to playing things like cs mixes, league gathers, pubg games etc with other people in the lower down channels. If you don't have to think twice, you know you're one of these.
2) Literally everybody else.
 
Don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong with this - you're free to talk to who you want. But it confuses me, there is no effort made with the extensive community at all. If this is the case, which it is, because there are some people who live in the OG channel that I haven't had a conversation with in like 2 years - why not just go to your own teamspeak? You aren't a fan of the new member base, you no longer like the games that OB attempts to try. Maybe you don't have to, but quite frankly, some of the stuff you guys say is pretty annoying. When I was quite high up in about a 1-2 years ago (in member terms) as in I was having long chats with Unseen/Conor about OB every day and hosting every other event - it was quite frankly pathetic seeing some of you post negative comments on here about things you were completely clueless about, about the effort that these people put in and the reasoning behind decisions that were made. I remember I actually used to laugh that some of you would post on member apps 'not sure who you are, would like to see you a bit more around before i give my +1' LMFAO. Of course you don't have a fucking clue who they are, the rest of us did because we actually played the servers with them, other games with them, or talked to them. Are they not integrated unless they go into that one channel? I remember that was actually a statement made by someone once.
But that moves on to communication - and here I will partially agree with you. The high council should and could be more communicative in decisions/plans/the state of OB. But TBH - what does Conor owe to you? It's like you think you're all part of some exclusive group, and you get annoyed if new, young people come along. Maybe that's changed - I don't really know how you welcome people in there anymore. If I do visit the OG channel I usually just mute myself within about 20 minutes, because it's just the same people making the same noises and jokes over and over again.
 
By all means continue doing what you're doing, complaining etc - but summarising this, thought I'd let you know that there's literally like 15-16 year olds who have messaged me in the past finding it bewildering with how some of you guys, 10 years their senior, act on teamspeak and comment on the forums. Discord hasn't gone ahead because of how much some of you raged and begged for it not to happen. Maybe you don't want OB to progress - and that's fine, but you need to see the other POV that some people do, we want more members, more servers. Maybe it's time to buy that teamspeak?
Anyway, feel free to bitch about me now amongst yourselves and this will probably seclude myself further from that channel. A new whatsapp group because you're scared of 'eyes'? Is this a year 6 playground or are we 20+ year old men? To quote Unseen 'no one gives a shit what is typed in there'
3 year rant build up over

He literally spent a year being held at the balls by the father of a girl he had hardly held hands with, how am I even in the same category?
These people thinking I don't keep up to date with the forums and chat complete shit smh 
 
Lewis beats Oldmike ez. Lewis is king of baits, would easily send Oldmike the wrong way ?
@Frostie vs @Kai idk how scuffed or not these smods are nowadays ?

He literally spent a year being held at the balls by the father of a girl he had hardly held hands with, how am I even in the same category?
These people thinking I don't keep up to date with the forums and chat complete shit smh 
 
Lewis beats Oldmike ez. Lewis is king of baits, would easily send Oldmike the wrong way ?
@Frostie vs @Kai idk how scuffed or not these smods are nowadays ?

?

good but not best
 

flashback with this one :eyes:

Got a variety of stuff I listen to, but mostly with chill vibe. Some more lyrical but a lot instrumental.
Listen to quite a lot of triphop/similar stuff. Lost my old playlist but some of the stuff I have from my all music list:
Also got my classics in likes of Crywolf, Blackmill, EDEN. Couldn't pick out set songs so just found some mixes with a bunch of their songs in:
Most of that stuff I probably posted in What Am I Listening To Now thread. I had a playlist at some point of variety of genres which was basically stuff I took from that thread, I think largely from @SonyTwan. Not sure if I got this from Sony or just found it going off something he linked tho:
 
I do enjoy house and EDM for more hyped, night out style but music that I listen to on the go-to, in the background while I'm doing other stuff I've always preferred to be more chill - a large chunk of rap couldn't be my go-to for this reason, even though I do listen to it on occasion.

Got a variety of stuff I listen to, but mostly with chill vibe. Some more lyrical but a lot instrumental.
Listen to quite a lot of triphop/similar stuff. Lost my old playlist but some of the stuff I have from my all music list:
Also got my classics in likes of Crywolf, Blackmill, EDEN. Couldn't pick out set songs so just found some mixes with a bunch of their songs in:
Most of that stuff I probably posted in What Am I Listening To Now thread. I had a playlist at some point of variety of genres which was basically stuff I took from that thread, I think largely from @SonyTwan. Not sure if I got this from Sony or just found it going off something he linked tho:
 
I do enjoy house and EDM for more hyped, night out style but music that I listen to on the go-to, in the background while I'm doing other stuff I've always preferred to be more chill - a large chunk of rap couldn't be my go-to for this reason, even though I do listen to it on occasion.

Got a variety of stuff I listen to, but mostly with chill vibe. Some more lyrical but a lot instrumental.
Listen to quite a lot of triphop/similar stuff. Lost my old playlist but some of the stuff I have from my all music list:
Also got my classics in likes of Crywolf, Blackmill, EDEN. Couldn't pick out set songs so just found some mixes with a bunch of their songs in:
Most of that stuff I probably posted in What Am I Listening To Now thread. I had a playlist at some point of variety of genres which was basically stuff I took from that thread, I think largely from @SonyTwan. Not sure if I got this from Sony or just found it going off something he linked tho:
 
I do enjoy house and EDM for more hyped, night out style but music that I listen to on the go-to, in the background while I'm doing other stuff I've always preferred to be more chill - a large chunk of rap couldn't be my go-to for this reason, even though I do listen to it on occasion.

Figured I'd chip in and have my once in a blue moon post.
I use both when I do still come on PC, though often I find myself using Discord as an info hub with general open chat while I use TS for more frequent voice chat and direct conversation.
@Chris Lord You might say people get raged at for using text channel, but that doesn't stop it being a means of communicating for when they initially join and are unable/too shy to speak. On top of that, don't underestimate the ability to send links that are only relevant to the group of people in your voice chat. Either you have to make a new group, send individual PMs or put it in an open channel that doesn't really suit the link at hand as it is seen by text chat only viewers on Discord.
TS also has features such as priority speaker that make managing events or coordinating groups of people on voice chat a lot easier.
@Fxden I'd disagree with that though and flip it. TeamSpeak is better for OB because of not being 'larger', that isn't to demean size or intent to expand but rather that OB has always preferred it's player base to be more tight knit and together. Discord allows for rapid expansion but at the expense of providing ample opportunity to be involved without being integrated.
On top of all that, OB is an old dog with a preference to a system it has been using for years - it won't change unless it absolutely has to and even then it will grumble xoxo

Figured I'd chip in and have my once in a blue moon post.
I use both when I do still come on PC, though often I find myself using Discord as an info hub with general open chat while I use TS for more frequent voice chat and direct conversation.
@Chris Lord You might say people get raged at for using text channel, but that doesn't stop it being a means of communicating for when they initially join and are unable/too shy to speak. On top of that, don't underestimate the ability to send links that are only relevant to the group of people in your voice chat. Either you have to make a new group, send individual PMs or put it in an open channel that doesn't really suit the link at hand as it is seen by text chat only viewers on Discord.
TS also has features such as priority speaker that make managing events or coordinating groups of people on voice chat a lot easier.
@Fxden I'd disagree with that though and flip it. TeamSpeak is better for OB because of not being 'larger', that isn't to demean size or intent to expand but rather that OB has always preferred it's player base to be more tight knit and together. Discord allows for rapid expansion but at the expense of providing ample opportunity to be involved without being integrated.
On top of all that, OB is an old dog with a preference to a system it has been using for years - it won't change unless it absolutely has to and even then it will grumble xoxo

Figured I'd chip in and have my once in a blue moon post.
I use both when I do still come on PC, though often I find myself using Discord as an info hub with general open chat while I use TS for more frequent voice chat and direct conversation.
@Chris Lord You might say people get raged at for using text channel, but that doesn't stop it being a means of communicating for when they initially join and are unable/too shy to speak. On top of that, don't underestimate the ability to send links that are only relevant to the group of people in your voice chat. Either you have to make a new group, send individual PMs or put it in an open channel that doesn't really suit the link at hand as it is seen by text chat only viewers on Discord.
TS also has features such as priority speaker that make managing events or coordinating groups of people on voice chat a lot easier.
@Fxden I'd disagree with that though and flip it. TeamSpeak is better for OB because of not being 'larger', that isn't to demean size or intent to expand but rather that OB has always preferred it's player base to be more tight knit and together. Discord allows for rapid expansion but at the expense of providing ample opportunity to be involved without being integrated.
On top of all that, OB is an old dog with a preference to a system it has been using for years - it won't change unless it absolutely has to and even then it will grumble xoxo

Figured I'd chip in and have my once in a blue moon post.
I use both when I do still come on PC, though often I find myself using Discord as an info hub with general open chat while I use TS for more frequent voice chat and direct conversation.
@Chris Lord You might say people get raged at for using text channel, but that doesn't stop it being a means of communicating for when they initially join and are unable/too shy to speak. On top of that, don't underestimate the ability to send links that are only relevant to the group of people in your voice chat. Either you have to make a new group, send individual PMs or put it in an open channel that doesn't really suit the link at hand as it is seen by text chat only viewers on Discord.
TS also has features such as priority speaker that make managing events or coordinating groups of people on voice chat a lot easier.
@Fxden I'd disagree with that though and flip it. TeamSpeak is better for OB because of not being 'larger', that isn't to demean size or intent to expand but rather that OB has always preferred it's player base to be more tight knit and together. Discord allows for rapid expansion but at the expense of providing ample opportunity to be involved without being integrated.
On top of all that, OB is an old dog with a preference to a system it has been using for years - it won't change unless it absolutely has to and even then it will grumble xoxo

Figured I'd chip in and have my once in a blue moon post.
I use both when I do still come on PC, though often I find myself using Discord as an info hub with general open chat while I use TS for more frequent voice chat and direct conversation.
@Chris Lord You might say people get raged at for using text channel, but that doesn't stop it being a means of communicating for when they initially join and are unable/too shy to speak. On top of that, don't underestimate the ability to send links that are only relevant to the group of people in your voice chat. Either you have to make a new group, send individual PMs or put it in an open channel that doesn't really suit the link at hand as it is seen by text chat only viewers on Discord.
TS also has features such as priority speaker that make managing events or coordinating groups of people on voice chat a lot easier.
@Fxden I'd disagree with that though and flip it. TeamSpeak is better for OB because of not being 'larger', that isn't to demean size or intent to expand but rather that OB has always preferred it's player base to be more tight knit and together. Discord allows for rapid expansion but at the expense of providing ample opportunity to be involved without being integrated.
On top of all that, OB is an old dog with a preference to a system it has been using for years - it won't change unless it absolutely has to and even then it will grumble xoxo

Figured I'd chip in and have my once in a blue moon post.
I use both when I do still come on PC, though often I find myself using Discord as an info hub with general open chat while I use TS for more frequent voice chat and direct conversation.
@Chris Lord You might say people get raged at for using text channel, but that doesn't stop it being a means of communicating for when they initially join and are unable/too shy to speak. On top of that, don't underestimate the ability to send links that are only relevant to the group of people in your voice chat. Either you have to make a new group, send individual PMs or put it in an open channel that doesn't really suit the link at hand as it is seen by text chat only viewers on Discord.
TS also has features such as priority speaker that make managing events or coordinating groups of people on voice chat a lot easier.
@Fxden I'd disagree with that though and flip it. TeamSpeak is better for OB because of not being 'larger', that isn't to demean size or intent to expand but rather that OB has always preferred it's player base to be more tight knit and together. Discord allows for rapid expansion but at the expense of providing ample opportunity to be involved without being integrated.
On top of all that, OB is an old dog with a preference to a system it has been using for years - it won't change unless it absolutely has to and even then it will grumble xoxo

Figured I'd chip in and have my once in a blue moon post.
I use both when I do still come on PC, though often I find myself using Discord as an info hub with general open chat while I use TS for more frequent voice chat and direct conversation.
@Chris Lord You might say people get raged at for using text channel, but that doesn't stop it being a means of communicating for when they initially join and are unable/too shy to speak. On top of that, don't underestimate the ability to send links that are only relevant to the group of people in your voice chat. Either you have to make a new group, send individual PMs or put it in an open channel that doesn't really suit the link at hand as it is seen by text chat only viewers on Discord.
TS also has features such as priority speaker that make managing events or coordinating groups of people on voice chat a lot easier.
@Fxden I'd disagree with that though and flip it. TeamSpeak is better for OB because of not being 'larger', that isn't to demean size or intent to expand but rather that OB has always preferred it's player base to be more tight knit and together. Discord allows for rapid expansion but at the expense of providing ample opportunity to be involved without being integrated.
On top of all that, OB is an old dog with a preference to a system it has been using for years - it won't change unless it absolutely has to and even then it will grumble xoxo

A tldr for those who found unseen's post too long:
 

Figured I'd chip in and have my once in a blue moon post.
I use both when I do still come on PC, though often I find myself using Discord as an info hub with general open chat while I use TS for more frequent voice chat and direct conversation.
@Chris Lord You might say people get raged at for using text channel, but that doesn't stop it being a means of communicating for when they initially join and are unable/too shy to speak. On top of that, don't underestimate the ability to send links that are only relevant to the group of people in your voice chat. Either you have to make a new group, send individual PMs or put it in an open channel that doesn't really suit the link at hand as it is seen by text chat only viewers on Discord.
TS also has features such as priority speaker that make managing events or coordinating groups of people on voice chat a lot easier.
@Fxden I'd disagree with that though and flip it. TeamSpeak is better for OB because of not being 'larger', that isn't to demean size or intent to expand but rather that OB has always preferred it's player base to be more tight knit and together. Discord allows for rapid expansion but at the expense of providing ample opportunity to be involved without being integrated.
On top of all that, OB is an old dog with a preference to a system it has been using for years - it won't change unless it absolutely has to and even then it will grumble xoxo

Winners: Team 3 / Zelka Reborn - Kai, Eagle, Rachel, Joji, Jesse, Rhyse
Each of you will be awarded OB Champ, the ESL OB Summer 2017 Trophy on the forums and possible other prizes (which I am not at liberty to award atm cus idk what they are lel).
Runners Up: Team 5 / Village People - Danny, Blyss, Mitch, Nuclear, Gunstar, Vemix
(interesting note: 'Team 3' won last time and Team 5' were runners up last time :thinking:)

The maps for the final were: Overpass (16-14, ZR win) / Cache (16-2, VP win) / Dust2 (16-8, ZR win). Although I was busy for most of the final, for the bits I watched and the feedback I heard it was a pretty close final so wp to both teams.
 

Group stage in case you didn't see my post in the other thread. 
 
Extra player stats, courtesy of big Lew: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/184copnOVqWqOlxljvXBfE0dToVLkwlqn-PTXvaTyQDo
 
As per, thanks to all who participated and wp to all. We saw our first OB tourney 16-0 and some other enjoyable moments, hopefully many were caught on stream and one day will pop up in a highlights video, just like that Spring tourney reel amirite 
Special thanks to @Lewis for hosting with me as per usual. Also to @Sir_Conor for setting up the server and being there to backup when I had to deal with irl memes yesterday. Thanks to @Oldmike for streaming and @Scrune for filling in for the one game. Some good casting all round from @Mintlou @Jamie @Thunder and even a bit of @Chris Lord too.
Admittedly at some point earlier in the year I said about making this larger scale, but I think both time constraints and also the community's investment in CS meant the style we went for this weekend suited far better. Thanks again and hope you enjoyed it xoxo