Admin complaint Gunstar

[Paradoxxx 15]

Admin Name: Gunstar

SteamID: STEAM_1:0:102804144

What did he do: I got slain for disagreeing with the admin. To give you some context. I gave a command that everyone should be against the back wall of the cell, when I said bananas for the 2nd time they would come out to a certain area. People were jumping outside so I shot them. They got killed for being outside of their cells AND not being against the backwall. This was harsh but I am a strict CT like everyone here probably has experienced. Gunstar and Rachel were the 2 victims who died. Immediately after the death Gunstar respawns both and after some shouting back and forth he slays me and eventually mutes me for disagreeing.

The discussion was about the fact that T's shouldnt be shot for not listening to commands if it isn't a life threatening situation. I completely disagreed and told him that not listening to the command is an act of rebellion. And the situation being what it was didnt require a warning shot either.

Below is an excerpt from the warning shot thread.

so if you're bhoping around, not being frozen, running off and coming back or just going the wrong way please do not cry when you die, if you're going to rebel or not listen to commands properly then don't expect to live long.

This clearly says and implies that in my situation I had the full right to shoot both of them without warning shots AND just shoot them in general for disobeying.

If ct's couldnt shoot t's untill they were in a life threatening situation every round would end in 30 seconds.

The second situation that occured was 3 rounds later.

We got to the climb on sg dojo with the TNT. I was running around on top of the glass part when suddenly afkkiller recalls all T's right on top of me.

Me and a few T's all noticed it and people were vocal about it aswel. But no reply from gunstar or course of action.

AFKKILLER had been trolling Brandon aswel and it all got dismissed for some reason.

Evidence: There were plenty of witnesses, and a few members of OB specifically for the recall part that were vocal/in text; Popey, Ducky, Revilia, Brandon etc.

Date of incident: 29/08/15 2145 gmt

[Gunstar]

Now my side of the story:

1. You shouldn't make up false claims like I muted u for arguing or I shouted at you? I think everyone who knows me knows that I don't shout. I simply slayed you since you kept arguing about it and delaying the continuation of the round and didn't respect the decision of a mod, you did the right thing by complaining here but did the wrong thing about stopping the round when you were selfishly trying to get your point across. I was calmly trying to explain to you about what you did wrong and you said "I don't care".

2. I also didn't say "T's shouldnt be shot for not listening to commands if it isn't a life threatening situation" - yet another lie. If you are going to make a complaint at least say the truth? I said you shouldn't KILL Ts like that if they are in no way threatening you. We simply stepped out of the cell because you said we have to be on the wooden planks in front of the cell and I will admit we jumped ahead and didnt wait for the "go" from you, and as we were going back you killed us both. I would have even accepted 1-2 warning shots there, but killing us? No. You didn't even give any warnings or say "be off the wall to die", I felt that at that point from past experience we don't kill for that in OB and made the decision tor respawn the players killed.

3.

This clearly says and implies that in my situation I had the full right to shoot both of them without warning shots AND just shoot them in general for disobeying.

There is a BIG difference in KILLING and Warning Shots. Killing means you are stopping them from playing on the server for the whole round, warning shot is letting them play but with a punishment for their SMALL crime...

About your 2nd part where you are really scratching the ground for small things to say, I was playing as T that game and didn't see the part where afkkiller recalled the Ts on you. Unless you expect me to have super fast robotic reactions and see everything everyone is doing while playing the game, sure I should have seen it. About trolling Brandon, you can ask him that I PMed him and said If he continues to troll he can show me evidence and I will take action against him, however without any proof I can't really do much. Don't just assume nothing is being done without actually knowing anything about it, that case doesn't even involve you.

[SonyTwan]

He still didn't break the rules from the sounds of it, including your post Gunstar.

Admitted yourself you didn't wait for the command.

"I simply slayed you since you kept arguing about it" - if he didn't break the rules why did you start an argument?

[Gunstar]

He still didn't break the rules from the sounds of it, including your post Gunstar.

Admitted yourself you didn't wait for the command.

"I simply slayed you since you kept arguing about it" - if he didn't break the rules why did you start an argument?

Yeah i admitted we didnt wait for the command, but why don't we get Killed for stepping off the spray when we are told to be on it? Coz we have warning shots, here we were told to be against the wall, we stepped off and died for it, which I thought was pretty unfair coz of this small mistake we had to wait an entire round.

Edit: 5 ♦ Warning shots should be given in minor non-threatening situations.

I felt like he did break the rule here, what me and raichu did, I would classify as minor -non-threatening situation, where he was on top of the stairs and we slightly off the place where we were meant to be.

The main reason for slaying as I said was that he kept arguing about it, insulting and not respecting my decision. There was nothing he was losing or gaining from us being re spawned and him getting his point across [which he could have done after].

I respect your words a lot Sony but if you still think I was at the wrong end here and the others agree, sure I will apologise and accept it.

[Paradoxxx]

I'll agree that you didn't shout, I was being loud and thats why I typed it as shouting at each other, it was a bad synonym for arguing.

I was slain and muted that round. So it isn't at all a false claim that I got those 2 admin actions enforced on me.

I said "I don't care" because your logic was wrong and not in line with the server rules and what is written about warning shots. I didn't say Idc because I hate the rules, I'm a complete rule person and you were too convinced for my liking that you were right about the situation that I snapped.That being said I appologise for being selfish by being loud.

2. You litterally said that warning shots should be given for non life threatening situations ( you quoted it from somewhere I thnk, I asked you the link but I didnt get any ), thats basicly the same thing as what I said in my OP. I disagreed with that.

As for the rebelling itself. I heard Rachel her part of the story and my part. She said you guys were outside just near the river but not in. ( her words )

I said you had to be against the backwall of the cell, thats a long way off.

According to the rules I dont have to give a warning shot or a vocal warning when you are that far off. I let everyone live that was off the wall, I wasnt going to allow outside the cell.

To quote Lorcan: you gotta be a little bit harsh on dojo.

I understand that in your past experience with other commanders you don't, but that experience shouldn't overrule the actual rules.

The 2nd part just added to the fuel.

[Gunstar]

I respect your respectful reply this time paradoxx. So I will respond with the same respect for you.

As for the rebelling itself. I heard Rachel her part of the story and my part. She said you guys were outside just near the river but not in. ( her words )

I said you had to be against the backwall of the cell, thats a long way off.

According to the rules I dont have to give a warning shot or a vocal warning when you are that far off. I let everyone live that was off the wall, I wasnt going to allow outside the cell.

To quote Lorcan: you gotta be a little bit harsh on dojo.

I understand that in your past experience with other commanders you don't, but that experience shouldn't overrule the actual rules.

I don't really consider it that far off to kill someone for and as for the quote, yes you have to be a little harsh on dojo coz of the vent cell, this was a different thing.

The 2nd part just added to the fuel.

It was completely irrelevant and I felt you were pushing it a bit too, so did Kartoffel.

After speaking with Kartoffel and discussing the 2 rules involved here:

5 ♦ Warning shots should be given in minor non-threatening situations.

♦ Ts who disobey CTs are rebels. Attacking a CT (in any circumstance) or disobeying a command mark a T as a rebel. Rebels may be shot on sight.

The first rule on it's own would mean that you broke the rule because we were in a very minor non-threatening situation. The 2nd rule however contradicts this as it says "disobeying a command mark a T as a rebel" - which to be honest can be interpreted differently, coz if tis was the case we are ALL rebels.

So coz of that you were right to kill us there, BUT it was quite harsh which was agreed by many on the server and Kartoffel. You are also known to be very strict and in some cases too strict. I felt what you did was very harsh even if it complied with the rules and I think that would be the ultimate conclusion here. I have always apologised when I did something wrong, so I will sincerely like to apologise to you and the troubles caused because ultimately I think I was wrong here. I will assess the situation better if a situation like this ever arises again.

[UnSeen]

This issue really doesn't need a public debate on a topic named 'admin complaint Gunstar'. As far as I'm aware something like this is just a misjudgment on both sides and really isn't the end of the world. I feel as if this is mostly resolved and if not take it to steam or TS3 chat to finish it off.

No need to target people or have a go at them for the way they command (regardless of your opinion on it) here, the post isn't needed on this particular thread. (This was at the person whose post I deleted).

Locked.